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Old 03-14-2010, 12:21 AM   #1
kbd1
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Angry Gtr transmission failure-mis-led by dealer

I have a 09 GTR Premium. Last month I brought the car into my local Nissan Dealership for the 5,000 mile oil change. I dropped the car off and was told they would have it ready in approx 2 hrs. I returned to pick the car up and was told that there was a recall on the transmission and that Nissan is requiring the TCM to be reprogrammed. I immediately told the service advisor I was aware of a new program that was loaded on the 2010 model that defeated the launch control feature and that I did NOT want that upgrade. I was assured that it was not this upgrade and that Nissan was requiring this upgrade to maintain the factory warranty. I again questioned this recall as I had never heard about it. The certified GTR tech approached me and stated that he was having problems as the new upgrade of the TCM triggered the engine light and he could not re-set it. 4 hours later he finally got the light to go off. I again asked him about this upgrade in which he stated that Nissan requires it and it will make the car perform better without losing the launch contol. Then he proceeds to hand me a document for me to sign after the fact. Upon reading the document he clearly stated that the car will now perform better as this new upgrade has eliminated the ability to turn the VDC off- "what????" I asked. Although I had never used launch contol I am fully aware that the "VDC" must be turned off in order to execute the launch mode. I refused to sign the document and demanded that he remove this new program from my car and restore it back to it's original state. Now realizing that he was wrong and Nissan had cleverly deceived him in removing my launch control he got the service manager involved. The Service Manager called Nissan GTR engineering and was told that the upgrade was developed for the 2010 and that they recommend the re-program but that it is not mandated. Therefore, it's not clear if the dealer was being overzealous and trying to bill Nissan for a recall campaign or if Nissan Corp. is forcing dealers to perform this recall, nevertheless-Nissan Corp told the dealer that the only way the TCM could be reprogrammed is to have it removed and shipped to California to be reprogrammed by the factory as they do not allow the dealer to have the 09 launch control program. At this point my car was there for over 6 hours for an oil I agreed to take the car and drive it but likely would return it to have the TCM removed and shipped to California for re-programming. I don't intend on ever using the launch contol but I did pay for this feature and don't agree with the way it was removed from my car without my consent or the dealer being up front with me. I do feel that it may affect the resale value of the car. As I said I took the car with the new program that was done against my will. LESS THAN 1500 MILES LATER- I was traveling on the interstate at a modest 70MPH and my GTR stalled as if the engine had stopped- I immediately pulled off the interstate and checked to see if perhaps the engine somehow overheated or I suspected I lost a turbo. I turned the engine off for 5 min then restarted and proceeded on my way- as I did the transmission was shifting through all odd gears only- 1st-3rd-then 5th rapidly with no power what so ever-the the TCM and Check Engine lights illuminated. I tried putting the transmission in the manual mode but it would not change from automatic. Keep in mind the car has never been launched and now I am having transmission issues. So now I'm suspect if the new program somehow has contributed to the transmission failure. I never had any problems with my GTR until the transmission was reprogrammed. Has anyone else experienced this problem? Now I being told that the transmission and TCM must be replaced at Nissan's expense of $20,000 + dollars but there are no transmissions in the United States yet the dealer claims that 70% of the transmissions that have failed had not been launched. Nissan Engineering will not tell me anything as to what the problem is requiring the replacement nor will they tell me if the new transmission on its way form Japan has been improved in any way. So now the question is- do I demand the original TCM program for the 09 or accept the 2010 program with the new transmission. Originally Nissan engineering stated that I had paid for launch control therefore I was entitled to it-now I being told that the shipment of the transmission is in a holding pattern because Nissan Corp is not willing to ship a new tranny with the 09 launch contol. So is it the launch contol causing problems (never been used on my car) or are there bigger issues that Nissan is hiding for their consumers? Any input on this matter would be greatly appreciated. I can be reached at kevindoran1@yahoo.com or 985 237 5029 if additional info is needed. Thanks
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Old 03-14-2010, 05:48 AM   #2
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whew!!!......

Ok first off the update that the GTR tech was performing on your GTR does not remove the Launch Control. Again it does not remove it. The Program instead lowers the Launch control rpm from the 4500rpm to 3500rpm. Also with the old launch control you had to turn off the VDC in order to use it which in turn voided your warranty from Nissan. With the new launch control you do not have to turn the VDC off to engage it. You can activate the new Launch control via any combo of switches or none at all. You just floor it and hold the brake and it shoots up to the rpm. Now Nissan states the new LC is better for a number of reasons,1 being it is less stressfull on the trans because it launches at a lower rpm, 2 it is faster from the launch because it doesnt have any wheel slip from a lower rpm launch, 3 it preloads the trans better versus the hard shock to the trans and drivetrain the old LC did. In order to be able to use the LC without voiding your warranty you must install the new LC. Nissan says it will not cover transmissions on the old LC.

I dont think the dealer misled you. They really dont know what the hell is going on. I also dont think they did the update procedure correctly because you said it triggered a Check engine light? It shouldnt take anywhere near as long as it took you. My update only took me over an hour with the oil and filter change that day. The smoking gun in your case was when he couldnt get the check engine light off. The TCM update shouldnt have anything to do with the ECM.

The TCM update does allow you to turn off the VDC. Again all this update does is lower the RPM that it launches at and it allows you to use the LC via any settings except snow I think. Also I know for me the update fixed a few quirks with my trans. After the update my trans shifted better and smoother. It will not affect your resale value having the new or old one. Honestly If I was looking at a used GTR I would want the updated LC and of course all you have to do to check it is perform the black box read out.

Where are you located so I know not to let them touch my car!!. At least Nissan is owning up and replacing your trans. The problem you are describing sounds like a solenoid or circlip issue. When a bad solenoid goes you only have a odd or even set of gears. I really dont think the new TCM program was the root cause of your trans problem. Again it sounds like a solenoid issue which is a pretty will known issue.

If you dont accept the updated TCM Nissan will not fix it. Physically the transmission is no different from 2009 to 2010 only the TCU Programming is. Again if you dont launch your car it wont matter and even if you do the new TCM with the updated LC is way better on your trans. Do a search and you will see just about everyone has done the update. Only people who are serious drag racers will opt out to keep the old LC. If it were my car sitting there I would get the updated LC / TCM knowing what I know.

Again please let us know which dealer this was. No one else should go there. Is this dealer/tech GTR Certified? Also let us know what build date your car is. (last four numbers on your VIN)

If you need any further help email me kickhard@aol.com
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Last edited by Kickhard; 03-14-2010 at 06:23 AM..
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Old 03-15-2010, 12:52 AM   #3
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Default transmission failure

I'm not so sure the launch control 1 is the problem for all these transmission failures. I've never launched my GTR or even been on a racetrack.

Is it the metal particles floating in the transmission coming in contact with the solenoids causing them to short or simply malfunctioning solenoids. Either way what is Nissan doing differently on the replacement transmissions? Newly designed solenoids or does the new LC2 program address that problem? If so, why did my solenoid(s) fail 1500 miles after the reprogram? If it is the metal particle senario- what is Nissan doing there? Using different harder metals or different lubricant??? Sounds to me that there is no gaurantee that this problem won't present itself again. Your thoughts???
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Old 03-15-2010, 12:55 AM   #4
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Why do you want to keep the launch control anyways? If you use it, it will void the warranty.
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Old 03-15-2010, 01:02 AM   #5
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Decided against keeping it- just suspect since I had absolutely no problems with the transmission until the upgrade LC2 was performed. Just want to make sure that the LC2 didn't contribute to the failure. Perhaps there were some other settings that the tech was able to manipulate to get the check engine light off when he reprogrammed the TCM with the LC2 program that ultimately caused the failure. Only Nissan knows and they are not releasing any information at the moment.
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Old 03-15-2010, 01:05 AM   #6
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What is Nissan's stance on warranty today when using launch control with the LC2 program????

What is their recommendation on changing the transmission oil and how much is this mystery oil??? I've heard of other GTR owners using a different type of oil that is supposely better than Nissan branded oil.
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Old 03-15-2010, 08:19 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CR8-10_GTR View Post
Why do you want to keep the launch control anyways? If you use it, it will void the warranty.
That is not true. You can use the Launch control without voiding your warranty. Thats why Nissan changed the LC and updated the transmission. I dont know why people still say that it will void your warranty when it was public knowledge when Nissan did the update and publicly changed the policy. Most of this is due to the lawsuit Nissan lost last year.

Again for the last time Nissan will not void your warranty if you use the LC with the updated version which Launches at 3500rpm versus 4500 rpm. Nissan states you can use the LC with any combo of switches(VDC off or on)

kbd1-The LC had nothing to do with your transmission issue. Absolutly nothing at all. Your trans was just one of the unlucky ones that probably had a solenoid failure.

There are several different options when it comes to the transmission fluid. Dodson makes fluid along with a company called Will All. They claim to make a fluid that is a better lubricant and provides better protection to the trans, it also helps in the temprature area by allowing for more heat protection which is a problem with the current fluid. There are several people running it. Some say it makes less noise and also. The Stock fluid will turn color when the thermal protection breaks down and it seems to do it fairly quickly. Thats why Nissan wants you to change it and check it often.
Do a search on the different types of fluid to hear what the converts have to say.
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Old 03-15-2010, 12:09 PM   #8
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Hey KBD1. Given the fact that you said you lost even gears, I would suspect that there is either metal shavings in the fluid causing the solenoids to stick in their bores inside the solenoid/valve body. This is why I highly recommend that ALL GT-R owners change their transmission fluid at 1000 miles and drain the fluid through a paint strainer to see all the metal shavings. Then, follow the factory service interval of 18,000 miles for the trans fluid. I have also seen the clutch piston seals develop small tears that causes a pressure loss, and thus not allowing even or odd gears to shift. So, I would assume that the problem is one of these two things.

If you guys wouldn't mind, please keep on posting here (instead of private email) so we can all try to help resolve this and learn something at the same time! This is valuable information for anyone else who is in your shoes in the future...many thanks!
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Old 03-15-2010, 04:45 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kickhard View Post
That is not true. You can use the Launch control without voiding your warranty. Thats why Nissan changed the LC and updated the transmission. I dont know why people still say that it will void your warranty when it was public knowledge when Nissan did the update and publicly changed the policy. Most of this is due to the lawsuit Nissan lost last year.

Again for the last time Nissan will not void your warranty if you use the LC with the updated version which Launches at 3500rpm versus 4500 rpm.
Where can this information be located?
Is this for the 2k9 models specifically?
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Old 03-15-2010, 05:25 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trancemynd View Post
Where can this information be located?
Is this for the 2k9 models specifically?

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Old 03-16-2010, 07:21 PM   #11
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Thank you MC

Its still amazing that after all the heat and Internet Crap Nissan took over the Launch Control that when Nissan fixes and makes it right they get no press or internet praise for it. Hell judging by the two posters here there are still people that dont know that Nissan changed its policy concerning the transmission, VDC, launch control.
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Old 03-17-2010, 05:18 PM   #12
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+1. And what amazes me also is that the orig poster's dealership and mechanic, though they don't sound nefarious, definitely sound clueless. I'd find an alternate GT-R technician FAST.
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Old 03-18-2010, 11:48 AM   #13
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Voided warranty words came straight from a dealer here, he also told me that LC was originally a glitch and wasn't supposed to be released to the public due to possibly blowing transmissions. Thanks for setting me straight. However, I still love Nissan and praise them every day for my wonderful machine!!
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Old 03-18-2010, 01:00 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CR8-10_GTR View Post
Voided warranty words came straight from a dealer here, he also told me that LC was originally a glitch and wasn't supposed to be released to the public due to possibly blowing transmissions. Thanks for setting me straight. However, I still love Nissan and praise them every day for my wonderful machine!!
Are you kidding me? The dealer said that crap? How long ago was this? Glitch? Nissan put the launch control in from the start and it was Nissan who informed the press, automobile magazines, and their own Dealers, GM's, GTR techs about it and taught them how to use it. This was the only way to achieve those incredible 0-60 times Nissan claimed. It was only after people started blowing transmissions from using the Launch Control (some within the first thousand miles) that Nissan realized it had a serious warranty problem and started to blame the owners and deny that the Launch Control even existed. Some dealers even told its customers that the GTR didnt even need to be broken in since it was from the factory and you could drive it hard from day one(can you believe that). Then came this statement from Nissan that if you turn off the VDC you automatically void the warranty(Of course this was the only way to activate the LC.

After Nissan's total cluster *uck dealing with this a few owners sometime in the middle of 2009 decided to take Nissan to court for turning down their transmission warranty claims and they won a class action against Nissan. As a result of this Nissan decided to change the LC program(from 4500rpm Launch to a 3500rpm Launch) and was supposed to warranty all future and past claims.

Your dealer should know this and if they dont they must not be reading all these bulletins Nissan is sending them.
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Old 11-04-2010, 09:26 AM   #15
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I have a transmission for sale!

We have just broken a GTR R35 2009 Black edition and have a gearbox / transmission for sale.

Sen miles - so practically new!sible money compared to Nissan main dealer prices and ,our vehicle had only covered
7484 miles upon arrival in to us - so practically new at a fraction of the price!

Claire
Charles Trent Limited
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trents.co.uk
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